I really did not think this was necessary, but someone left a comment about how "overrated" Derek Jeter is. First, I want to say that I love when people disagree with me, it makes this blog better, and creates sports arguements, especially one who made good points like the person who left the comment. It was knowledgable and I respect that opinion. However, it is a false one.
Let me first state that yes, there are a lot of bandwagon Yankees fans, however, I personally do not know one single band wagon Yankee fan. In fact, if anyone tried (Which I am not sure if this person was doing) to call me a band wagon fan, I would respond by probably giving you a run down of the history of your team. Not that it means anything, but most likly I know more about your team than you do your own team. That is for people in general. not for this particular person. Secondly, I would then run down the history of the Yankees starting with them becoming the Yankees from the Highlanders which were previously the Baltimore Orioles franchise. I would go into 1920 Babe Ruth sale and how they played in the Polo Grounds and John mcGraw kicked them out because Ruth was drawing more for the Yanks than the Giants did, and 1923 first year of the old stadium and their first championship and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So, until you actually have talked to me as a sports fan, dont call me a bandwagon hopper, because chances are my knowledge is far superior than yours.
Ok, now that is out of the way, lets get to your arguement, which by the way, is filled with some very strong points. For one, your right, I dont if Jeter was on another team he would be who he is, or if he was a good looking guy. However, Mariano is Hispanic and is a legend in Yankee and baseball land. In fact, Jeter is half black, so saying if he was another color or race on the Yankees would make a difference, I would say no. As for the hits record, I personally was very aware of it, I have been since 2004. I cant speak for anyone than myself and a few of my good Yankee friends, however, people, older fans, were talking about it for a while when I went to games. You can overhear conversations and it was in the papers since 2006 when Jeter passed 2,000 hits. And yes, I knew Gehrig held the record. Secondly, the hits record is a MONUMENTAL deal. I dont know what your talking about. When Rose broke Cobb in 1985 vs the Padres, everyone, media, fans were going nuts. Getting over 4,000 hits is simply insane, and a VERY big deal before Jeter even got close to 3,000. Do you remember the celebrations of Gywnn, Ripken, recently Biggio when he got there? It is a HUGE deal, it is one of the most rare things you can do, getting over 3,000 hits and automatically puts you in the Hall of Fame.
I think this is your best point on Jeter as a captain. Your right, I was complaining about him too during the draught, and the 9th inning of Game 5 was a killer mistake. I get on him for that, and your right, not enough Yankees fans do, which believe me pisses me off probably as much as you. In Yankees fans minds Jeter has earned that, which I think is sort of dumb, but he has earned his way out of a lot of things. He definatly deserved to get bashed for that double play. As a captain, Jeter really has not done that good of a job, your right, it must be nice to have that lineup and team surrounding you this year. However, he does motivate the team by how hard he plays, and by how much he wants to win. This is a fact, every player who has played for the Yankees outside of A-Rod and Chad Curtis has "loved" Jeter. If you dont believe me, read the comments after some players left. Jeter does not say anything to the press, but frankly neither does Bill Belicheck. Does that not make Belicheck a good leader because he is an asshole to the press? The guy wins every year, he won 11 games with Matt Cassell for god sakes.
As for the Tim Duncan comparison, I disagree, Jeter DOES make players better. The flip play is a good example, he saved Shane Spencer's ass on that one. That was a run for sure. Do you know how many errors he saved Chuck Knoblauch during his throwing the ball away stage. He also makes pitchers better, for when he was younger the in the hole jump throw play, the behind the head catch, he made both those plays hundreds of times, saving hundreds of runs along the way. With the bat, Jeter makes his teammates better as well. Anytime, ANYTIME a big hit is needed Jeter gets it. He hit over .350 in the World Series this year, he hit the Walk Off vs Arizona, he hit two huge homers vs the Mets, one to lead off the game in the 2000 World Series. Do you know how much momentum that gives a team to lead off a game with a Home Run, especially that of the World Series. He did that same thing in the ALCS this year. He never hits home runs until he gets to the postseason, where he is now 5th on the ALL TIME HOME RUN LIST in the playoffs. Pretty amazing for a guy who has averaged about 15 for his career. Seriously, I cannot list all of the big hits he has had, there are too many. I am being serious, not a smart ass, he has had too many big hits since 1996. Even as a rookie, he had an rbi single to bring home Joe Girardi to make it 2-0 Yankees in Game 6 of the World Series. Who was that off of? Greg Maddux in his prime. When he gets on base it fires other guys up, whether leading off an inning, or trying to get a two out rally. How about his stealing ability? He has stolen over 300 bases, and most of them seem to come in big spots. As a base runner, Jeter is usually always heads up and rarely if ever makes a mistake on the base path. Want to know how valuable he is, take a look at maybe his worst year 2008 the Yankees missed the postseason for the first time in his career. I am telling you that had a lot to do with Jeter not performing well at the plate, and in the field.
Throw out the numbers, the intangibles he brings a team are so significant, his desire to win so great, that is why he makes players better. This is a fact. If you were in a group project, and there was a prize, and one guy in your group was so driven, and helped you out on certain things in the project, and influenced the group, and you as well, your telling me that passion would not rub off on you? I know it would on me, and by the end I would have done everything in my power to win that group project. This is what Jeter brings to the table, besides all the stats I just threw at you.
As for Mariano, he is the most valuable player of that four. There is no denying that. He is the greatest pitcher I have and will ever seen, and I agree he should get more credit, which he is starting to recieve recently. As for A-Rod, if your going to call Jeter a "stats" player than what is A-Rod an "Uuber Stats" player. This is the same guy who hit two homers and 7 RBIS on the last day of the season JUST SO HE COULD GET TO 30-100!!! This is also the king of the "we are up 10-2 in the ninth I will now hit a grand slam." These are called pulling an A-Rod. I love A-Rod, I have defended him for years, but to say Jeter is more of a stats guy than A-Rod is absurd. A-Rod did an amazing job this postseason, and without him the Yankees would not have won, but that is why baseball is a team game, EVERYONE for the most part, must contribute to win a World Series. A-Rod, for once, did his part. Listen, Tim Duncan can have an off series and still win a Championship because players like Parker, Manu, and now Richard Jefferson could step up and contribute. In baseball, a marquee player cant have an off series, unless your Mark Teixeria. If A-Rod or Jeter have an off series, we dont win this year.
So in closing, I think you made some solid points, you were clear, but I think my points will show that Derek Jeter is deserving of all the praise he recieves.
- Lew
Agree with you on almost everything Lew except one thing. In basketball if Tim Duncan or any star player has an off series it will be almost impossible for their team to win a championship series. I believe basketball is the ultimate team game along with football which is why guys like Lebron cannot win a championship right now. It took Kobe many years after Shaq to win one because he did not have the team he needed around him.
ReplyDeleteYes baseball is a team sport as well but everyone does not play together like they do in basketball. For example, Teixera had an awful world series but other players stepped up which is why Yankees won. In 2008, Rollins batted .227 in world series and Utley batted .167 but the Phillies still beat up on the Rays. Star players can have a bad series in baseball and their teams can still win.
But I disagree completely with that guy who shit on Jeter. He is a great leader and deserves all the accolades that he gets.
-Mote
Lewin, this short novel further proves that your knowledge of yankees parallels that of the most die hard fans. I know this bc u watch every single game and have done so for as long as u remember. Ill take ure word for it. I know that our dads would keep each other busye conversation fodder for hours on end, easily. You still need to come see the shrine that is the yankee basement in my home.
ReplyDeleteTwo things on how I hold Jeter in my view. Long, long after he retires his name along with Mariano's will be commonplace with names like mantle, ruth, etc bc of what they did for the franchise. I can guarantee that. As for people who argue abue about his post season stats, its valid, but there's one thing to consider. Because of the mpdern era (jeter can't do anything about it) and the addition of the ALDS and alcs championship series, it provides an opportunity to bloat stats in comparison with the old days where if u won the pennant in the regular season u went automatically to the world series. My dad and I talk about this a lot because mantle was one of the post season ststas leaders for hour's and rbi's for many years until david justice strolled through and bernie. You also could look at Jeter's clutch abilities and say that because of the addition of the two series that he plays an even more integral role because they have to win those two to get to the big shabang. I may be digressing a bit but to go back to the point of jeter being overrated just doesn't fly in my mind. Great start to hopefully a high-volume response topic reader.
Young ben,
And can someone get joey-d on here. I miss him
Mote, I agree basketball is the ultimate team sport, but the reason why Duncan could have an off series, or any "loaded" team is because of the other guys stepping up like Manu, Parker, and now maybe RJ. Your right though, most NBA teams stars cant have off series because there are only 4 other guys on the team.
ReplyDeleteAs for young Ben, your right, Mantle was the ultimate postseason hero, and Jeter's and Bernie's stats over look that because of the ALDS and ALCS good point.
I didn't read this post because it began with a picture of Derek Jeter and was over 3 paragraphs long. When is the first Mets post?
ReplyDelete- CoLean
the remark about bandwagon fans was not intended towards you. Just a slap in the face to those who are.
ReplyDeleteYou should write an article on why the NETS will get Lebron and the Knicks will look like clowns.
Knicks+ Nets this season 2-16?? Nets at least get a good draft pick the way things are going. Knicks will probably take some scrub from lithuania again. Thanks Jazz.
ReplyDeleteSad, sad day middle of may
1-16
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